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Rob Granger Posted: May 05, 2008 11:59 AM	Fusion Gun Problem Fusion Gun less than a year old and the fluid leaks by the side seal as the gun body is deteriorating. Any body else having the problem? Other than changing gun brand what is the fix... MY gun will be replaced under warranty but this is actually the second time it has happened to 2 different guns. Thanks
Posted: May 07, 2008 10:31 PM	You have to specify where the leak is coming from. Out past the O-rings or from the side seal to the mix chamber. Sounds like a maintainance problem to me, we have some pretty old heads (ones I purchased used) worn down to bear metal that still work fine. Good cleaning, new o-rings, fresh polycarbaloy side seals, polished mix chamber. And Viola a Fusion gun that works as advertised.
Posted: May 08, 2008 05:59 AM	i too have a gaggle of fusions,,they work fine all the time,,any errors have been caused by me and my maintainance,,,or lack of it... i do not grease the gun and put it down for the nite,,,we soak our parts in "cider" and rebuild a clean set in the am,,,slight grease on rings to assist with reassembly... why just yesterday,,,we had the A side of the chamber "cheese-up" from the isoy-grease,,seems ryan greased the girl and put her down a couple of days ago...i kicked his butt and he is now doing his job and tearing the gun down at the end of the day (you see i told him,,,you cant believe everything you read,,,jeez)... the gun body is not deteriorating,,,serious man,,,if so your proportioner, your hose lines and everything elese would be deteriorating too... i too used to think it has to be the equipments fault,,,it wasnt 95% of the time,,, there are a gazillion fusions out there and they are working as they are supposed to...i would guess you are doing something "wrong" (im sorry man,,dont take it personal,im trying to help,,serious) in the assembly of the guns parts.. sounds like you have a great vendor if they are swapping things out for you... good luck today man,,and stay with it,,you will get it figured out,, 'dude
Rob Granger Posted: May 08, 2008 06:56 AM	We do not break the gun down ever day and we do fill it with grease at the end of the day. We were basically taught that unless there is a problem do not tear it down. Many people have told us that they go weeks before they tear down their gun. We went to CPI school before we started and we follow their training. Dont know what is going on. I just want to solve the problem. It doesn't help when you try to start a job and the gun malfunctions and you have to pull off because the gun needs replacing. Thanks for the advice..... What kind of cider are you using?
Michael Flander Posted: May 08, 2008 02:51 PM	The gun was designed not to be torn down every night. Not that it is wrong if you want to, but you definitely should not have problems with the gun strictly because you greased it. A couple of things jumped out at me when I read about this problem: The fusion head is just anodized aluminum. You must use nylon brushes only. If you use any stiffer brushes you will damage the head over time cause the failures you are describing. If you are using anything but nylon brushes this could be causing your issue. On the same note, be very careful with picks or anything else you use on the head itself. All it takes is one little chip or gouge to get the ball rolling.... As far as greasing the gun goes, there is a concept that goes unmissed by a lot of people. I am going to take the time and explain it. When you are greasing the fusion gun(or the p2 for that matter), you are not trying to "lube" anything. You are trying to seal the side ports of the mix chamber with grease. You are also trying to stop any "floating" material in and around the area from hardening(kind of like putting tsl on your pumps). So when you are greasing the gun at night there are a couple things you should do to make sure this is done right. First: With the air ON, you want to pump a few squirts of grease in the gun until it starts coming out of the mix chamber itself. You need to verify this. Sometimes the grease will come out around the aircap or through the aircap, but the grease must come out of the mix chamber itself. If you can not get the grease to do this or to flow through the head, you must tear apart the gun and find or fix the problem. Second: After you have put a couple squirts through the gun with the air on and made sure it is flowing through the mix chamber, you then want to turn the air off and do a minimum of 3 squirts into the gun. The first part makes sure grease is flowing, this part will then fill the "cavity" around the mix chamber and seal the side ports. I usually do 4-5 squirts for good measure, grease is cheap and time is not. If you turn the air on again or the mix chamber/piston get moved for any reason, you must repeat this process as it will clear the grease from around the side ports and allow air in. This is why the seal around the air cap and the rear seal are important. After this is done, some people even like to dip the drill bit in cleaning solvent and leave it in the gun overnight to help remove any remaining material in the mix chamber. This will make the gun be as close to new as possible every night. If you do this though, you need to make sure the gun is very secure and that someone can not easily bump the drill vise, if you break the drill bit off in the mix chamber it may result in having to replace the mix chamber. Do this at your own risk. I'm glad to hear they are replacing your gun heads under warranty. We sell a lot of fusion guns and have very few problems with them, although I have seen one here and there where the head has failed as described. Get it replaced and get back to spraying!
Posted: May 11, 2008 10:17 AM	We don't break the gun down unless we are having problems. And if we are having problems it is always due to someone not putting the gun together properly. Usually if the gun is working properly and put together correctly we can spray many jobs on the same gun. Grease it, it works. I give it a couple of pumps, with the manifold shut off, take off the safety, give a couple pumps trigger the gun a couple of times to wipe the side seals and tip clear, then one more for good luck. O-rings don't last forever, change em on a regular basis and keep the trigger pulled.

Author

Comments

Rob Granger

Posted: May 05, 2008 11:59 AM

Fusion Gun Problem

Fusion Gun less than a year old and the fluid leaks by the side seal as the gun body is deteriorating. Any body else having the problem? Other than changing gun brand what is the fix... MY gun will be replaced under warranty but this is actually the second time it has happened to 2 different guns. Thanks

Posted: May 07, 2008 10:31 PM

You have to specify where the leak is coming from. Out past the O-rings or from the side seal to the mix chamber. Sounds like a maintainance problem to me, we have some pretty old heads (ones I purchased used) worn down to bear metal that still work fine. Good cleaning, new o-rings, fresh polycarbaloy side seals, polished mix chamber. And Viola a Fusion gun that works as advertised.

Posted: May 08, 2008 05:59 AM

i too have a gaggle of fusions,,they work fine all the time,,any errors have been caused by me and my maintainance,,,or lack of it...
i do not grease the gun and put it down for the nite,,,we soak our parts in "cider" and rebuild a clean set in the am,,,slight grease on rings to assist with reassembly...
why just yesterday,,,we had the A side of the chamber "cheese-up" from the isoy-grease,,seems ryan greased the girl and put her down a couple of days ago...i kicked his butt and he is now doing his job and tearing the gun down at the end of the day (you see i told him,,,you cant believe everything you read,,,jeez)...
the gun body is not deteriorating,,,serious man,,,if so your proportioner, your hose lines and everything elese would be deteriorating too...
i too used to think it has to be the equipments fault,,,it wasnt 95% of the time,,,
there are a gazillion fusions out there and they are working as they are supposed to...i would guess you are doing something "wrong" (im sorry man,,dont take it personal,im trying to help,,serious) in the assembly of the guns parts..

sounds like you have a great vendor if they are swapping things out for you...

good luck today man,,and stay with it,,you will get it figured out,,
'dude

Rob Granger

Posted: May 08, 2008 06:56 AM

We do not break the gun down ever day and we do fill it with grease at the end of the day. We were basically taught that unless there is a problem do not tear it down. Many people have told us that they go weeks before they tear down their gun. We went to CPI school before we started and we follow their training. Dont know what is going on. I just want to solve the problem. It doesn't help when you try to start a job and the gun malfunctions and you have to pull off because the gun needs replacing. Thanks for the advice..... What kind of cider are you using?

Michael Flander

Posted: May 08, 2008 02:51 PM

The gun was designed not to be torn down every night. Not that it is wrong if you want to, but you definitely should not have problems with the gun strictly because you greased it.

A couple of things jumped out at me when I read about this problem:

The fusion head is just anodized aluminum. You must use nylon brushes only. If you use any stiffer brushes you will damage the head over time cause the failures you are describing. If you are using anything but nylon brushes this could be causing your issue.

On the same note, be very careful with picks or anything else you use on the head itself. All it takes is one little chip or gouge to get the ball rolling....

As far as greasing the gun goes, there is a concept that goes unmissed by a lot of people. I am going to take the time and explain it.

When you are greasing the fusion gun(or the p2 for that matter), you are not trying to "lube" anything. You are trying to seal the side ports of the mix chamber with grease. You are also trying to stop any "floating" material in and around the area from hardening(kind of like putting tsl on your pumps). So when you are greasing the gun at night there are a couple things you should do to make sure this is done right.

First: With the air ON, you want to pump a few squirts of grease in the gun until it starts coming out of the mix chamber itself. You need to verify this. Sometimes the grease will come out around the aircap or through the aircap, but the grease must come out of the mix chamber itself. If you can not get the grease to do this or to flow through the head, you must tear apart the gun and find or fix the problem.

Second: After you have put a couple squirts through the gun with the air on and made sure it is flowing through the mix chamber, you then want to turn the air off and do a minimum of 3 squirts into the gun. The first part makes sure grease is flowing, this part will then fill the "cavity" around the mix chamber and seal the side ports. I usually do 4-5 squirts for good measure, grease is cheap and time is not.

If you turn the air on again or the mix chamber/piston get moved for any reason, you must repeat this process as it will clear the grease from around the side ports and allow air in. This is why the seal around the air cap and the rear seal are important.

After this is done, some people even like to dip the drill bit in cleaning solvent and leave it in the gun overnight to help remove any remaining material in the mix chamber. This will make the gun be as close to new as possible every night. If you do this though, you need to make sure the gun is very secure and that someone can not easily bump the drill vise, if you break the drill bit off in the mix chamber it may result in having to replace the mix chamber. Do this at your own risk.

I'm glad to hear they are replacing your gun heads under warranty. We sell a lot of fusion guns and have very few problems with them, although I have seen one here and there where the head has failed as described. Get it replaced and get back to spraying!

Posted: May 11, 2008 10:17 AM

We don't break the gun down unless we are having problems. And if we are having problems it is always due to someone not putting the gun together properly. Usually if the gun is working properly and put together correctly we can spray many jobs on the same gun. Grease it, it works. I give it a couple of pumps, with the manifold shut off, take off the safety, give a couple pumps trigger the gun a couple of times to wipe the side seals and tip clear, then one more for good luck. O-rings don't last forever, change em on a regular basis and keep the trigger pulled.

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