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Author	Comments
Joel Sikkila Posted: Apr 23, 2011 12:47 PM	PTO generator Hello all. I am a newbie to the industry, but have been reading the posts for some time. The info here is invaluable, and I thank you all for sharing. I am in the process of planning my spray rig set-up, and have decided for various reasons to go with a box truck instead of the pick-up/trailer combo. In reading the boards and posts, I have not come across any comments about a PTO driven generator utilizing the readily available power supply of the truck's engine. There is an interesting one available (www.realacpower.com) that I am looking into. I would like to hear some feedback on the pros and cons of such a set-up. It seems to me that the reduction of weight, required floorspace in the box and the added benefit of not having two diesel engines to maintain outweighs the disadvantage of having the truck run at idle speeds for extended periods. I appreciate any insight that others might have on this. Secondly, I have decided on a Graco H25, but am a little concerned about the comments I read about the circuit boards frying. My question here for the guys that have had this problem is, are you running off a generator or shore power or does it make a difference? Also, has anyone tried installing a whole-panel surge protector such as you might find in a house? I wonder if these type of units might help with the situation? Thanks in advance for your help. I'm just a new guy trying not to make too many mistakes...
Posted: Apr 23, 2011 09:33 PM	Do you have the room under the hood of a box truck for a 30-40 KW Generator or would you have to catch it somewhere else. I use to help install on our tuna boats all of the time and they had room and it was still tight. One time, the generator spun a bearing sheared the shaft and locked up causing the main engine to lock up also. They ended up cutting off with a torch so they could crank the main engine up and get in. Sucked for them with no lights, single si-ban, radar, vhf or plotter/gps on a strong norther coming through trying to get home on a 24 hour straight run from just off the EEZ. Atleast you can walk home! Goodluck, I hope it works!
Joel Sikkila Posted: Apr 23, 2011 10:35 PM	Thanks for the encouragement, bayouboy. The generator I am considering is a 60kVA unit, and it actually mounts behind the cab, between or on the side of the frame rails. This locates it directly under the box of the truck, which appears to be an ideal situation, not to mention the fact that I can save about $8-10k... According to the manufacturer, there is no loss of ground clearance to speak of, but because I don't seem to find much reference to guys doing this, I hope I am not making the wrong decision...
steven argus Posted: Apr 24, 2011 11:04 AM	Up here in the rust belt, I would worry about mounting a unit under the truck without any protection from road salt. I also worry about being so dependant on the engine in the truck. Unless you can afford a new or newer truck. We only drive junk so I don't know what new box truck smell is like. All that said, we are considering a "newer" box truck for our next rig. Considering the combo gen/compressor from Next gen power or Dimon. They do have PTO units that are pretty slick. Remember that not all box trucks have a PTO, so check first. As far as the H25, you don't have to worry for the first 12 months - warrantee. Our H25, 6 months, no problems, knock on wood. Make sure you deal w/ a distributor who can support you. Make sure they have boards in stock.
Daniel X Posted: Apr 24, 2011 05:12 PM	So you're basically moving wear and tear from one engine to another, the efficiency will be worse, etc. etc. It sounds like a re invent the wheel sort of plan, let us know how it works out. Have you sprayed before?
Joel Sikkila Posted: Apr 24, 2011 07:30 PM	Thank you guiness and dl123 for the constructive, albeit skeptical, criticism. That is why I posted the question in the first place - to get feedback... I am hoping that with a new, or newer, box truck that the additional wear and tear on the engine will be of minimal concern. As far as previous experience, I have seen it done quite a bit, and also helped a local contractor a bit as well, but am also planning to attend George Spanos' conference in Lincoln, NH to increase my awareness. Knowing that you cannot replace experience with "book learning", I also have a customer lined up who is willing to give me a shot at his new building for which we will do underslab insulation, foundation insulation, exterior walls and roof. For me, this is an unbelievable situation to earn my "foam wings" :)
steven argus Posted: Apr 24, 2011 10:06 PM	Sorry if I sounded skeptical. It wasn't intended. You're in good hands with George. keep us posted on your progress. Good luck.
Reggie Titmus Posted: Apr 25, 2011 08:55 AM	We have 2 box trucks with PTO Generator's. I really like this set up has worked out great for us. Generator mounted inside box in "Generator/compressor room" Pullies and belt to run 3 phase for both rigs G250 spray equipment. Trucks runs at about 1500 RPM's when using PTO. On dash is a speed control letting Tech know when RPM's are set at right speed. This set up is much quieter than rig with standby generator in box. As with everything proper maintenance keeps everything running good.
Posted: Apr 26, 2011 04:25 AM	pto units work great,,the company you are lookin at is top shelf... consider,,,box trux are big,,,90+% of the time you will be ok,,but as a start up business you will be doing work in hillbilly nowhere at times,,and access with a big rig could be iffy,,, we have trouble at times with a 30' gooseneck,,and i can stick it up a stone masons buttcrack,,,and our 20' bumper is tough sometimes as well,,,so consider,,, i run an e30 for the last 6 years hooked to shore power at times,,,as well as tandemed to the big rigs genset,,,at times,,, when on the big rig,,think about it,,2 compressors hittin,,2 proportioners workin and heaters hittin,,air dryers,,band heaters,,comfort heaters,,lites,,,the works in 2 rigs,,crap hittin all over the place on the genset and no burnt boards,,,ever,,, could these folks burnin boards be using asynchronis gensets???you know your box store 7500kw pos???,,,, and about proportioners,,,the h25 is a fine machine,,,buy an h40,,,get er done,,,the upgrade will reap rewards in output,,,you wanna shot cathedrals or squirt cathedrals...??
Joel Sikkila Posted: Apr 26, 2011 11:05 PM	Thank you all for the valuable advice. I'm doing my best to be a sponge here... BTW, for those interested, I just got my quote back on the PTO generator - $15k for a 60kw- guess the savings aren't quite what I had hoped :( Waiting to hear back on the CummingsOnan version now... Winco is one third the cost, but not quite the quality (no coated windings, less insulation rating of the wiring, etc). Still plan to move forward with the overall plan, though...

Author

Comments

Joel Sikkila

Posted: Apr 23, 2011 12:47 PM

PTO generator

Hello all. I am a newbie to the industry, but have been reading the posts for some time. The info here is invaluable, and I thank you all for sharing. I am in the process of planning my spray rig set-up, and have decided for various reasons to go with a box truck instead of the pick-up/trailer combo. In reading the boards and posts, I have not come across any comments about a PTO driven generator utilizing the readily available power supply of the truck's engine. There is an interesting one available (www.realacpower.com) that I am looking into. I would like to hear some feedback on the pros and cons of such a set-up. It seems to me that the reduction of weight, required floorspace in the box and the added benefit of not having two diesel engines to maintain outweighs the disadvantage of having the truck run at idle speeds for extended periods. I appreciate any insight that others might have on this.

Secondly, I have decided on a Graco H25, but am a little concerned about the comments I read about the circuit boards frying. My question here for the guys that have had this problem is, are you running off a generator or shore power or does it make a difference? Also, has anyone tried installing a whole-panel surge protector such as you might find in a house? I wonder if these type of units might help with the situation?

Thanks in advance for your help. I'm just a new guy trying not to make too many mistakes...

Posted: Apr 23, 2011 09:33 PM

Do you have the room under the hood of a box truck for a 30-40 KW Generator or would you have to catch it somewhere else.

I use to help install on our tuna boats all of the time and they had room and it was still tight. One time, the generator spun a bearing sheared the shaft and locked up causing the main engine to lock up also. They ended up cutting off with a torch so they could crank the main engine up and get in. Sucked for them with no lights, single si-ban, radar, vhf or plotter/gps on a strong norther coming through trying to get home on a 24 hour straight run from just off the EEZ.

Atleast you can walk home!

Goodluck, I hope it works!

Joel Sikkila

Posted: Apr 23, 2011 10:35 PM

Thanks for the encouragement, bayouboy. The generator I am considering is a 60kVA unit, and it actually mounts behind the cab, between or on the side of the frame rails. This locates it directly under the box of the truck, which appears to be an ideal situation, not to mention the fact that I can save about $8-10k... According to the manufacturer, there is no loss of ground clearance to speak of, but because I don't seem to find much reference to guys doing this, I hope I am not making the wrong decision...

steven argus

Posted: Apr 24, 2011 11:04 AM

Up here in the rust belt, I would worry about mounting a unit under the truck without any protection from road salt. I also worry about being so dependant on the engine in the truck. Unless you can afford a new or newer truck. We only drive junk so I don't know what new box truck smell is like.

All that said, we are considering a "newer" box truck for our next rig. Considering the combo gen/compressor from Next gen power or Dimon. They do have PTO units that are pretty slick.

Remember that not all box trucks have a PTO, so check first.

As far as the H25, you don't have to worry for the first 12 months - warrantee. Our H25, 6 months, no problems, knock on wood. Make sure you deal w/ a distributor who can support you. Make sure they have boards in stock.

Daniel X

Posted: Apr 24, 2011 05:12 PM

So you're basically moving wear and tear from one engine to another, the efficiency will be worse, etc. etc.

It sounds like a re invent the wheel sort of plan, let us know how it works out.

Have you sprayed before?

Joel Sikkila

Posted: Apr 24, 2011 07:30 PM

Thank you guiness and dl123 for the constructive, albeit skeptical, criticism. That is why I posted the question in the first place - to get feedback... I am hoping that with a new, or newer, box truck that the additional wear and tear on the engine will be of minimal concern. As far as previous experience, I have seen it done quite a bit, and also helped a local contractor a bit as well, but am also planning to attend George Spanos' conference in Lincoln, NH to increase my awareness. Knowing that you cannot replace experience with "book learning", I also have a customer lined up who is willing to give me a shot at his new building for which we will do underslab insulation, foundation insulation, exterior walls and roof. For me, this is an unbelievable situation to earn my "foam wings" :)

steven argus

Posted: Apr 24, 2011 10:06 PM

Sorry if I sounded skeptical. It wasn't intended. You're in good hands with George. keep us posted on your progress. Good luck.

Reggie Titmus

Posted: Apr 25, 2011 08:55 AM

We have 2 box trucks with PTO Generator's. I really like this set up has worked out great for us. Generator mounted inside box in "Generator/compressor room" Pullies and belt to run 3 phase for both rigs G250 spray equipment. Trucks runs at about 1500 RPM's when using PTO. On dash is a speed control letting Tech know when RPM's are set at right speed. This set up is much quieter than rig with standby generator in box. As with everything proper maintenance keeps everything running good.

Posted: Apr 26, 2011 04:25 AM

pto units work great,,the company you are lookin at is top shelf...
consider,,,box trux are big,,,90+% of the time you will be ok,,but as a start up business you will be doing work in hillbilly nowhere at times,,and access with a big rig could be iffy,,,
we have trouble at times with a 30' gooseneck,,and i can stick it up a stone masons buttcrack,,,and our 20' bumper is tough sometimes as well,,,so consider,,,

i run an e30 for the last 6 years hooked to shore power at times,,,as well as tandemed to the big rigs genset,,,at times,,,
when on the big rig,,think about it,,2 compressors hittin,,2 proportioners workin and heaters hittin,,air dryers,,band heaters,,comfort heaters,,lites,,,the works in 2 rigs,,crap hittin all over the place on the genset and no burnt boards,,,ever,,,
could these folks burnin boards be using asynchronis gensets???you know your box store 7500kw pos???,,,,
and about proportioners,,,the h25 is a fine machine,,,buy an h40,,,get er done,,,the upgrade will reap rewards in output,,,you wanna shot cathedrals or squirt cathedrals...??

Joel Sikkila

Posted: Apr 26, 2011 11:05 PM

Thank you all for the valuable advice. I'm doing my best to be a sponge here... BTW, for those interested, I just got my quote back on the PTO generator - $15k for a 60kw- guess the savings aren't quite what I had hoped :( Waiting to hear back on the CummingsOnan version now... Winco is one third the cost, but not quite the quality (no coated windings, less insulation rating of the wiring, etc). Still plan to move forward with the overall plan, though...

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