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Dave Hounsome Posted: Sep 14, 2009 11:46 AM	another new foamer with questions I am interested in possibly starting a spray foam business that would primarily do residential foam insulation, possibly industrial as well. I am currently a chemical engineer for a flexible slabstock polyurethane foam manufacturer in Canada, but the flex slab business has gone down hill real fast in the last 3-4 years. Currently at about 50% of what it used to be. With attending the CPI (SPI, API, PFA) meetings over the years I have come to learn that the spray foam industry is the only polyurethane industry in North America that is showing growth. But my employer doesn't want to move into this industry. I am very familiar with the chemistry and equipment needed for a spray foam business but I do have some questions that I hope you guys can help with. I am located in Ontario, Canada and have done a search on this website,the CUFCA website, and the yellow pages to try and find out how many other spray foamers are in the area. It seems like there are about 12-15 spray foamers in the Toronto, Hamilton, Niagara region. Here are the questions. 1. As someone starting out, is it possible to succeed with growing your business as a part time venture, working evenings and weekends until things get going with regular jobs? 2. What would the rate of growth be for a start-up company? 3. What size population base is required to keep contractors happy. For example 50-100,000 population per contractor, or more or less? 4. Can you run your company from home at the start or do you need a commercial address? 5. If running it from home, how does insurance come into play when storing the drums of material in your trailer on your driveway? 6. When starting out, is it better to save some money on the rig (say budget $40K for the trailer) knowing full well that when things get busier that a new rig would be required? But then you would have 2 rigs for 2 crews. 7. How much of a budget would you suggest to spend on marketing of the product, web page, yellow pages, fliers, direct mail, etc. 8. Being located in a colder climate, does the iso side need to be kept warm 24/7 or can it be warmed the day of or day before use? 9. Are there any reputable companys who sell spray rigs in Ontario? 10. Or is there any downside to importing a rig from the US. in regards to electrical codes for the equipment and service? Thanks for your time and it has been quite a learning experience already with reading up on this site.
Travis Richtmyer Posted: Sep 22, 2009 01:35 PM	test
Dave Hounsome Posted: Nov 19, 2009 12:48 PM	bump
Brian Bothun Posted: Apr 13, 2010 10:26 PM	I'm pretty new to the industry myself but one thing I learned right off the bat is you can build a rig yourself for much cheaper. Alot of the rigs you will look at have fancy stainless all over stainless toolboxes diamond plate floors. It all just adds to the cost and you dont need it. Do some research check out a few rigs and build your own.
Dean Nash Posted: Apr 14, 2010 10:29 PM	1. Tough, but doable. Especially relative to your climate. 2. 5-10 sets of product per month and you'll work your a$$ off making it happen. 3. The "census" has little to do with your success. The demographic's of your market, especially in this economy would be more important. New construction? Retro? Roofing? Block fill? You'll have to do some research relative to a 75 mile radius around you. 4. Running it from home should be OK initially. The trick is setting up material deliveries. Call for more help here. 5. I'd suggest you ask your agent as I suspect it varies however, a "general liability" policy would cover contents of your trailer in most cases provided you allowed for it. Again, check with your agent. 6. NO! The most important investment is your first purchase. You'll need equipment, product, and sales support to compete. ALL of which, should be included with your rig purchase and THEY will be your "best friends" for several months after your purchase and through your learning curve. Listen to BB, and you drastically reduce your probability for success. 7. Marketing? A question that many will answer but one typically yielding minimal results. Focus on YOUR demographics and YOUR market. A website is fantastic but needs supplemental support. Call for details and additional help. 8. BOTH! Temperature control is your foremost concern and a quality rig will include this feature both during operation and when the rig is parked in your yard. Do not settle for anything less. 9. I'm confident there are but can't speak for any. I'd be focused on establishing a relationship with a foam company that can support you foremost; discuss, debate, and negotiate the equipment package desired-calculate your budget and move forward from there. 10. None that I'm aware of however the paperwork for shipping has proven a little cumbersome in the past. Good luck 877-342-3413 Joe
Posted: Apr 11, 2011 10:34 AM	bump
John Shockney Posted: Apr 11, 2011 05:56 PM	And remember to pay yourself first when doing a business plan, start with how much money do you need to live then figure your mark up and how much foam do you need to spray per day, week or month to feed yourself and your household. I have very low overhead mostly due to location so I don’t have to make as much per set or spray as much foam as contractors working out of big city locations do to cover their overhead. But the biggest thing an business owner will tell you is to have a business plan and remember that like most battle plans “they rarely survive the first encounter with the enemy (customer)” so be ready to make changes and adjust to changes in the business. Airpro
steven argus Posted: Apr 11, 2011 07:44 PM	Don't forget Insurance. -Empolyees workers comp. -Disibility insurance -Liability insurance -Equipment insurance -etc -etc And make sure you are insured for Spray foam, not just fiberglass/ cellulose. Diferent rates involved here. Take it from me, you will eventually need your insurance.
Erney Thiessen Posted: Apr 17, 2011 10:15 PM	I'm in the same boat you are. Seeing potential, wanting to get into the business and from Ontario. I currently work as an industrial electricain. I found 2 rig manufacturers. Bolair in Milton and PFSI in Waterloo. I have quotes from both and they are approx $80K. (A bit hard on the 40K budget) As far as building your own rig, why not eliminate the large generator. Most of your power requirements are for heat. From my industrial experience, a small diesel thermal oil heater would easily heat material for 2 sprayers. Of course you would still need a generator for the compressor, porportioner and hose heater, but you could get away with a much smaller one. Saving trailer weight, space and $$. Has anyone ever tried this? Just a thought. However I'm gonna buy my first rig. Would like to try this for my second rig. Good luck. Erney
Daniel X Posted: Apr 17, 2011 10:56 PM	Be careful what advice you take to heart from this board, half of the members are just sales reps for suppliers/equipment and wont have any real world advice for you. Basically anybody who needs you to call them isn't actually spraying foam, just trying to sell you a rig and a set of foam.
Posted: Apr 18, 2011 06:19 AM	most of my power requirements are for processing.. e30 3ph 15k htr,,,62amp h25 3ph 15k htr,,,59amp h40 3ph 20k htr,,,95amp 10 hp comp starts at 48amps runs at 24 amps a 30k gen will give you about 125 amp at 240v,,, if you look at em,,,the only thing that change is the can on the back,,,so the weight is not much more,,, like harley back tires,,bigger is better,,you cant have enough power in you spray rig,,lites,,cellphones,,spotlites on the sprayfoammagazine.com calandar...oh yeah,,radiant heat...

Author

Comments

Dave Hounsome

Posted: Sep 14, 2009 11:46 AM

another new foamer with questions

I am interested in possibly starting a spray foam business that would primarily do residential foam insulation, possibly industrial as well. I am currently a chemical engineer for a flexible slabstock polyurethane foam manufacturer in Canada, but the flex slab business has gone down hill real fast in the last 3-4 years. Currently at about 50% of what it used to be. With attending the CPI (SPI, API, PFA) meetings over the years I have come to learn that the spray foam industry is the only polyurethane industry in North America that is showing growth. But my employer doesn't want to move into this industry.
I am very familiar with the chemistry and equipment needed for a spray foam business but I do have some questions that I hope you guys can help with.

I am located in Ontario, Canada and have done a search on this website,the CUFCA website, and the yellow pages to try and find out how many other spray foamers are in the area. It seems like there are about 12-15 spray foamers in the Toronto, Hamilton, Niagara region.

Here are the questions.
1. As someone starting out, is it possible to succeed with growing your business as a part time venture, working evenings and weekends until things get going with regular jobs?
2. What would the rate of growth be for a start-up company?
3. What size population base is required to keep contractors happy. For example 50-100,000 population per contractor, or more or less?
4. Can you run your company from home at the start or do you need a commercial address?
5. If running it from home, how does insurance come into play when storing the drums of material in your trailer on your driveway?
6. When starting out, is it better to save some money on the rig (say budget $40K for the trailer) knowing full well that when things get busier that a new rig would be required? But then you would have 2 rigs for 2 crews.
7. How much of a budget would you suggest to spend on marketing of the product, web page, yellow pages, fliers, direct mail, etc.
8. Being located in a colder climate, does the iso side need to be kept warm 24/7 or can it be warmed the day of or day before use?
9. Are there any reputable companys who sell spray rigs in Ontario?
10. Or is there any downside to importing a rig from the US. in regards to electrical codes for the equipment and service?

Thanks for your time and it has been quite a learning experience already with reading up on this site.

Travis Richtmyer

Posted: Sep 22, 2009 01:35 PM

test

Dave Hounsome

Posted: Nov 19, 2009 12:48 PM

bump

Brian Bothun

Posted: Apr 13, 2010 10:26 PM

I'm pretty new to the industry myself but one thing I learned right off the bat is you can build a rig yourself for much cheaper. Alot of the rigs you will look at have fancy stainless all over stainless toolboxes diamond plate floors. It all just adds to the cost and you dont need it. Do some research check out a few rigs and build your own.

Dean Nash

Posted: Apr 14, 2010 10:29 PM

1. Tough, but doable. Especially relative to your climate.

2. 5-10 sets of product per month and you'll work your a$$ off making it happen.

3. The "census" has little to do with your success. The demographic's of your market, especially in this economy would be more important. New construction? Retro? Roofing? Block fill? You'll have to do some research relative to a 75 mile radius around you.

4. Running it from home should be OK initially. The trick is setting up material deliveries. Call for more help here.

5. I'd suggest you ask your agent as I suspect it varies however, a "general liability" policy would cover contents of your trailer in most cases provided you allowed for it. Again, check with your agent.

6. NO! The most important investment is your first purchase. You'll need equipment, product, and sales support to compete. ALL of which, should be included with your rig purchase and THEY will be your "best friends" for several months after your purchase and through your learning curve. Listen to BB, and you drastically reduce your probability for success.

7. Marketing? A question that many will answer but one typically yielding minimal results. Focus on YOUR demographics and YOUR market. A website is fantastic but needs supplemental support. Call for details and additional help.

8. BOTH! Temperature control is your foremost concern and a quality rig will include this feature both during operation and when the rig is parked in your yard. Do not settle for anything less.

9. I'm confident there are but can't speak for any. I'd be focused on establishing a relationship with a foam company that can support you foremost; discuss, debate, and negotiate the equipment package desired-calculate your budget and move forward from there.

10. None that I'm aware of however the paperwork for shipping has proven a little cumbersome in the past.

Good luck
877-342-3413
Joe

Posted: Apr 11, 2011 10:34 AM

bump

John Shockney

Posted: Apr 11, 2011 05:56 PM

And remember to pay yourself first when doing a business plan, start with how much money do you need to live then figure your mark up and how much foam do you need to spray per day, week or month to feed yourself and your household.

I have very low overhead mostly due to location so I don’t have to make as much per set or spray as much foam as contractors working out of big city locations do to cover their overhead.

But the biggest thing an business owner will tell you is to have a business plan and remember that like most battle plans “they rarely survive the first encounter with the enemy (customer)” so be ready to make changes and adjust to changes in the business.

Airpro

steven argus

Posted: Apr 11, 2011 07:44 PM

Don't forget Insurance.

-Empolyees workers comp.
-Disibility insurance
-Liability insurance
-Equipment insurance
-etc
-etc

And make sure you are insured for Spray foam, not just fiberglass/ cellulose. Diferent rates involved here.

Take it from me, you will eventually need your insurance.

Erney Thiessen

Posted: Apr 17, 2011 10:15 PM

I'm in the same boat you are. Seeing potential, wanting to get into the business and from Ontario. I currently work as an industrial electricain.

I found 2 rig manufacturers. Bolair in Milton and PFSI in Waterloo. I have quotes from both and they are approx $80K. (A bit hard on the 40K budget)

As far as building your own rig, why not eliminate the large generator. Most of your power requirements are for heat. From my industrial experience, a small diesel thermal oil heater would easily heat material for 2 sprayers. Of course you would still need a generator for the compressor, porportioner and hose heater, but you could get away with a much smaller one. Saving trailer weight, space and $$. Has anyone ever tried this? Just a thought.

However I'm gonna buy my first rig. Would like to try this for my second rig.

Good luck.
Erney

Daniel X

Posted: Apr 17, 2011 10:56 PM

Be careful what advice you take to heart from this board, half of the members are just sales reps for suppliers/equipment and wont have any real world advice for you.

Basically anybody who needs you to call them isn't actually spraying foam, just trying to sell you a rig and a set of foam.

Posted: Apr 18, 2011 06:19 AM

most of my power requirements are for processing..
e30 3ph 15k htr,,,62amp
h25 3ph 15k htr,,,59amp
h40 3ph 20k htr,,,95amp

10 hp comp starts at 48amps runs at 24 amps

a 30k gen will give you about 125 amp at 240v,,,

if you look at em,,,the only thing that change is the can on the back,,,so the weight is not much more,,,
like harley back tires,,bigger is better,,you cant have enough power in you spray rig,,lites,,cellphones,,spotlites on the sprayfoammagazine.com calandar...oh yeah,,radiant heat...

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