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richard sucher II Posted: Jan 20, 2012 10:12 AM	Cold weather foam systems Looking for input on what closed cell cold weather foam systems are being sprayed. Looking at work accessed from outside and currently well below freezing. Not worried about yield loss, just looking for product that can be sprayed with decent adhesion, etc. Specifically, what systems are you spraying and down to what temps. Are claims of 23-25 degrees doable. How about the teens. Data sheets be damned for temperature limitations. How low can you go?
Lynn Mether Posted: Jan 20, 2012 12:51 PM	Sprayed down to 25 with thermoseal, 30 with bayseal.
mason Posted: Jan 21, 2012 08:35 AM	I have sprayed hundreds of brands of foam in the last 41 years. A supplier can make formulas that go pretty low, but they have a tendency to be harder to work with. The lowest temperature I sprayed was -10 degrees F. The foam was specially formulated for this specific job. We had to spray in a freezer that could not be turned off. The job took 2 years to complete and we used more than 500,000 lbs of foam. I am familiar with foams nowadays that can be sprayed to substrates down to 35 degrees F. I would try a kit out first to see what kind of physical properties and adhesion I had on different substrates at that temperature. For example, you might have good adhesion on a block wall but not on a metal substrate. (Note, put a sample substrate in your refrigerator and then spray a pass 1 inch thick over it and see what happens) Ask your supplier's tech rep their experience spraying their cold weather foam in different conditions and substrates. Ask for references of other contractors who have used the foam in similar climates to yours. A rule of thumb when spraying on colder substrates. Make your first pass around 1/2 inch thick. That is the minimum required to make a good foam but will be more likely to have good adhesion than putting down a 1 or 2 inch lift. That first 1/2 inch will insulate the substrate so you can spray thicker lifts after the first lift has cured. It may take longer for the foam to set up and cure properly in cold weather so don't go back over it too soon. The foam should be strong, with good compressive strength and adhesion. Check out the cell structure next to the substrate. If the material has a super thick high density skin at the substrate interface, it might be brittle causing it to crack and let go.
Bryan Kwater Posted: Jan 22, 2012 09:03 AM	This year we have sprayed NCFI insulbloc at about 12 degrees to a wood substrate successfully. The best foam at lower temps that we have tried. The rep claims that it can be sprayed at single digits, but we have not tried it. Not sure against metal or block at the lower temps though.
mark moyer Posted: Jan 28, 2012 05:31 PM	last year basf to -5 osb with 25mph wind,,,heatwagon on like it mattered,,yes it was singing,,...this year its been mild,, reality,,spray to whatever your substrate will allow,,,data sheet be damned indeed,, in the end,,,it could be 70 friggin degrees and the pope could be on the gun,,you could be dead on ratio,,and if theres a prob..bottom line,, "applicator error",,,guarrantee,,so spray to whatever you can push the envelope to,,heck they are sellin the stuff aint they???if they didnt want it sprayed in cold weather for real they wouldnt sell it.yeah right,,lol,,(data sheet says dont apply below 50 but they ship to areas that area below freezin,,,hmmm,,stewardship,,indeed,,lips moving,,wing tips tappin,,,) lets get this party friggin started...

Author

Comments

richard sucher II

Posted: Jan 20, 2012 10:12 AM

Cold weather foam systems

Looking for input on what closed cell cold weather foam systems are being sprayed. Looking at work accessed from outside and currently well below freezing. Not worried about yield loss, just looking for product that can be sprayed with decent adhesion, etc. Specifically, what systems are you spraying and down to what temps. Are claims of 23-25 degrees doable. How about the teens. Data sheets be damned for temperature limitations. How low can you go?

Lynn Mether

Posted: Jan 20, 2012 12:51 PM

Sprayed down to 25 with thermoseal, 30 with bayseal.

mason

Posted: Jan 21, 2012 08:35 AM

I have sprayed hundreds of brands of foam in the last 41 years. A supplier can make formulas that go pretty low, but they have a tendency to be harder to work with. The lowest temperature I sprayed was -10 degrees F. The foam was specially formulated for this specific job. We had to spray in a freezer that could not be turned off. The job took 2 years to complete and we used more than 500,000 lbs of foam.

I am familiar with foams nowadays that can be sprayed to substrates down to 35 degrees F. I would try a kit out first to see what kind of physical properties and adhesion I had on different substrates at that temperature. For example, you might have good adhesion on a block wall but not on a metal substrate. (Note, put a sample substrate in your refrigerator and then spray a pass 1 inch thick over it and see what happens)

Ask your supplier's tech rep their experience spraying their cold weather foam in different conditions and substrates. Ask for references of other contractors who have used the foam in similar climates to yours.

A rule of thumb when spraying on colder substrates. Make your first pass around 1/2 inch thick. That is the minimum required to make a good foam but will be more likely to have good adhesion than putting down a 1 or 2 inch lift. That first 1/2 inch will insulate the substrate so you can spray thicker lifts after the first lift has cured. It may take longer for the foam to set up and cure properly in cold weather so don't go back over it too soon. The foam should be strong, with good compressive strength and adhesion. Check out the cell structure next to the substrate. If the material has a super thick high density skin at the substrate interface, it might be brittle causing it to crack and let go.

Bryan Kwater

Posted: Jan 22, 2012 09:03 AM

This year we have sprayed NCFI insulbloc at about 12 degrees to a wood substrate successfully. The best foam at lower temps that we have tried. The rep claims that it can be sprayed at single digits, but we have not tried it. Not sure against metal or block at the lower temps though.

mark moyer

Posted: Jan 28, 2012 05:31 PM

last year basf to -5 osb with 25mph wind,,,heatwagon on like it mattered,,yes it was singing,,...this year its been mild,,
reality,,spray to whatever your substrate will allow,,,data sheet be damned indeed,,
in the end,,,it could be 70 friggin degrees and the pope could be on the gun,,you could be dead on ratio,,and if theres a prob..bottom line,,
"applicator error",,,guarrantee,,so spray to whatever you can push the envelope to,,heck they are sellin the stuff aint they???if they didnt want it sprayed in cold weather for real they wouldnt sell it.yeah right,,lol,,(data sheet says dont apply below 50 but they ship to areas that area below freezin,,,hmmm,,stewardship,,indeed,,lips moving,,wing tips tappin,,,)
lets get this party friggin started...

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