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Peter Woods Posted: Jan 28, 2008 08:56 AM	Generic Foam Direct from Manufacturer We are looking to get into the business, substantial past construction experience. Any suggestions as to the best and safest "green" foam product to use. I'm probably thinking closed cell. It seems like manufacturers want a substantial fee to be a dealer, then you purchase product from the manufacturer at the price dictated by the manufacturer, and then they want to sell you all the equipment. Are there chemical companies were small companies can directly buy "generic" spray foam products that are just as effective and much less expensive than being sold by the big foam companies??? Has any body tried it or is it possible to make your own spray foam products on your site with the help of a knowledgable chemist, etc. Are there generic formulas out there that would not violate patent rights? Thanks a lot. Any information would be greatly appreciated.
mason Posted: Jan 28, 2008 09:17 AM	The safest and greenest foam is a matter of opinion and there are arguments from all sides on the issue. All SPF is going to help save enery in buildings, reduce air infiltration and help to control moisture condensation if installed properly. A new applicator requires the following to be able to install the foam correctly. 1. Knowledge of the physical properties of the foam and how it can be used effectively in their design and environment. 2. Knowledge of the equipment,how to maintain it, clean the gun, troubleshoot it 3. Knowledge on how to apply the foam, how to spray the different types of foams in a variety of applications and environments. 4. Knowledge of safety and health considerations and regulations concerning the use of SPF 5. Knowledge of building codes In order to acquire the skill and knowledge required to install SPF, you need to have the right equiipment and training. It cannot be done cheaply. I strongly recommend that you buy equipment from a supplier that can set up the equipment, provide the training and be available when needed. Most foam suppliers sell equipment and provide training, either by themselves or through their distributors. You may find one supplier is more responsive in a particular area than another. Foam systems vary somewhat from supplier to supplier. Each foam takes a slightly different heat and pressure for optimum results. The more you try other brands the less consistency you are likely to obtain and the less support from your suppliers. it is a good idea to stay with one brand of foam until you have sufficient experience to try others. Once you have acquired sufficient knowledge of the systems, equipment and foam applications, (typically takes over a year) you could start trying other brands to see if you have a preference. How do you determine which company is best for you? Check out their references, both for their applicators and satisfied building owners. How financially sound are they? Are they responsive to your technical inquiries? What is their quality control program? How long is the training? What does it cover? Who does the training? Also, check into SPFA's Accreditation program courses. These have been developed by a cross section of the industry and include items that might not be covered by a company's proprietary training.
Michael Flander Posted: Jan 28, 2008 11:41 AM	Could not have said it any better Mason. Do I need written permission to quote your statements made from this board in writing? Thanks, Mike Flander
mason Posted: Jan 28, 2008 09:15 PM	No, just give me credit and use my caveat. . "The information provided herein, based on current customs and practices of the trade, is offered in good faith and believed to be true, but is made WITHOUT WARRANTY, EITHER EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, AS TO FITNESS, MERCHANTABILITY, OR ANY OTHER MATTER. MASON KNOWLES CONSULTING DISCLAIMS ALL LIABILITY FOR ANY LOSS OR DAMAGE ARISING OUT OF ITS USE. Individual manufacturers and contractors should be consulted for specific information."
Michael Flander Posted: Jan 29, 2008 09:59 AM	Gracias..
Peter Woods Posted: Jan 29, 2008 11:53 AM	Thank you for the responses, Mason in particular. Everything made perfect sense. Originally, I should have added: proper training will be done, insurance coverage in place, proper equipment and training on same will be done, and business centered on meeting the needs of customers. I was attempting to inquire, probably done poorly, about the "greenest" foam which would be the most sensitive to the environment. Thanks again.
quentin Posted: Jan 29, 2008 07:12 PM	The companies I have had any dealings with I would suggest are as follows though your milage with any and all will vary. UCSC though it is not a green foam if I remember right. http://www.buyucsc.com/ Spray Foam Distributers of N.E. Inc He is a member here and George is a great guy from my dealings with him. He also sells a water blown foam though I am not sure how green it is beyond that. I believe his site is http://www.sprayfoambusiness.com/index.html Contact him fist if I were you. Finally there is CPi who have a foam school you can attend with a discount for others that go with you where you don't have to buy anything first but I am not sure how green ther foam products are beyond also being water blown. http://www.cpillc.com/
Tim O'Keefe Posted: Jan 29, 2008 10:23 PM	All foam is green to an extent! When you use foam you are super insulating your home and you use less fossil fuels to heat/cool that structure which is better for the environment. Water blown foam does not release any harmful CFC's or HCFC's as a result of off-gassing. Further there are water blown bio-based foams available that increase the "green" factor even more. I would recommend a water blown closed cell foam before I recommend any bio-based foams that are on the market! BTW George's site is www.freedomfoam.com! Tim Granite State Spray Foam Co.

Author

Comments

Peter Woods

Posted: Jan 28, 2008 08:56 AM

Generic Foam Direct from Manufacturer

We are looking to get into the business, substantial past construction experience. Any suggestions as to the best and safest "green" foam product to use. I'm probably thinking closed cell. It seems like manufacturers want a substantial fee to be a dealer, then you purchase product from the manufacturer at the price dictated by the manufacturer, and then they want to sell you all the equipment. Are there chemical companies were small companies can directly buy "generic" spray foam products that are just as effective and much less expensive than being sold by the big foam companies??? Has any body tried it or is it possible to make your own spray foam products on your site with the help of a knowledgable chemist, etc. Are there generic formulas out there that would not violate patent rights?
Thanks a lot. Any information would be greatly appreciated.

mason

Posted: Jan 28, 2008 09:17 AM

The safest and greenest foam is a matter of opinion and there are arguments from all sides on the issue.

All SPF is going to help save enery in buildings, reduce air infiltration and help to control moisture condensation if installed properly. A new applicator requires the following to be able to install the foam correctly.
1. Knowledge of the physical properties of the foam and how it can be used effectively in their design and environment.
2. Knowledge of the equipment,how to maintain it, clean the gun, troubleshoot it
3. Knowledge on how to apply the foam, how to spray the different types of foams in a variety of applications and environments.
4. Knowledge of safety and health considerations and regulations concerning the use of SPF
5. Knowledge of building codes

In order to acquire the skill and knowledge required to install SPF, you need to have the right equiipment and training. It cannot be done cheaply. I strongly recommend that you buy equipment from a supplier that can set up the equipment, provide the training and be available when needed. Most foam suppliers sell equipment and provide training, either by themselves or through their distributors. You may find one supplier is more responsive in a particular area than another.

Foam systems vary somewhat from supplier to supplier. Each foam takes a slightly different heat and pressure for optimum results. The more you try other brands the less consistency you are likely to obtain and the less support from your suppliers.

it is a good idea to stay with one brand of foam until you have sufficient experience to try others.

Once you have acquired sufficient knowledge of the systems, equipment and foam applications, (typically takes over a year) you could start trying other brands to see if you have a preference.

How do you determine which company is best for you?

Check out their references, both for their applicators and satisfied building owners. How financially sound are they? Are they responsive to your technical inquiries? What is their quality control program? How long is the training? What does it cover? Who does the training?

Also, check into SPFA's Accreditation program courses. These have been developed by a cross section of the industry and include items that might not be covered by a company's proprietary training.

Michael Flander

Posted: Jan 28, 2008 11:41 AM

Could not have said it any better Mason. Do I need written permission to quote your statements made from this board in writing?

Thanks,
Mike Flander

mason

Posted: Jan 28, 2008 09:15 PM

No, just give me credit and use my caveat.
. "The information provided herein, based on current customs and practices of the trade, is offered in good faith and believed to be true, but is made WITHOUT WARRANTY, EITHER EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, AS TO FITNESS, MERCHANTABILITY, OR ANY OTHER MATTER. MASON KNOWLES CONSULTING DISCLAIMS ALL LIABILITY FOR ANY LOSS OR DAMAGE ARISING OUT OF ITS USE. Individual manufacturers and contractors should be consulted for specific information."

Michael Flander

Posted: Jan 29, 2008 09:59 AM

Gracias..

Peter Woods

Posted: Jan 29, 2008 11:53 AM

Thank you for the responses, Mason in particular. Everything made perfect sense. Originally, I should have added: proper training will be done, insurance coverage in place, proper equipment and training on same will be done, and business centered on meeting the needs of customers.

I was attempting to inquire, probably done poorly, about the "greenest" foam which would be the most sensitive to the environment.

Thanks again.

quentin

Posted: Jan 29, 2008 07:12 PM

The companies I have had any dealings with I would suggest are as follows though your milage with any and all will vary.

UCSC though it is not a green foam if I remember right.

http://www.buyucsc.com/

Spray Foam Distributers of N.E. Inc

He is a member here and George is a great guy from my dealings with him. He also sells a water blown foam though I am not sure how green it is beyond that. I believe his site is

http://www.sprayfoambusiness.com/index.html

Contact him fist if I were you.

Finally there is CPi who have a foam school you can attend with a discount for others that go with you where you don't have to buy anything first but I am not sure how green ther foam products are beyond also being water blown.

http://www.cpillc.com/

Tim O'Keefe

Posted: Jan 29, 2008 10:23 PM

All foam is green to an extent! When you use foam you are super insulating your home and you use less fossil fuels to heat/cool that structure which is better for the environment. Water blown foam does not release any harmful CFC's or HCFC's as a result of off-gassing. Further there are water blown bio-based foams available that increase the "green" factor even more. I would recommend a water blown closed cell foam before I recommend any bio-based foams that are on the market! BTW George's site is www.freedomfoam.com!

Tim
Granite State Spray Foam Co.

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