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Circle-D Posted: May 12, 2013 09:08 PM	SPFA Certification What is everyones take on the PCP program the SPFA has introduced? I am all for proper application of our product but feel this is an extremley expensive way to get it. All you 30+ year veterans have to drop back and start as assistants, then go to installers, then to master installers all the while paying threw the nose. If your a member it ONLY costs you $250 to registar, $200 for EACH test and then ONLY $950 for the field exam.That comes out to $1800 to get to the master installer level and then another $175 for the annual renewal. If your not a member this rises to $2600 and $225 annual renewal. Seems I read somewhere in the SPFA vision statement about making this "affordable among our intended constituency." Seems like there is a contridiction of terms here?? As I stated, I'm all for doing it right and making sure we have qualified applicators. I think the best way to get voluntary compliance with the program is to make it "affordable among our intended constituency." If your an assitant, take the test and move on to the next level. If your already a veteran, take the master installer test and pay the fee, pass or fail. You shouldn't be required to start at the bottom to support a fundraiser. I realize it took a lot of money to get this project off the ground and it needs to pay for itself. If more people take the one or two tests they need instead of only a few taking all of them the revenue will follow. So folks, as foamdude would say "this is to provoke dialog" Am I looking at this from the wrong angle? I would like to support the program but don't really have the $2600 to dump. I have only been in the business for 6 years and still consider myself a newbie but don't really think I need to go all the way back to first grade either. I have NEVER been asked about certification or qualifactions by any of my customers....EVER. So why spend the dough. I spray the Bayer foam and have been certified to the Silver level by them. They tell me I am the only Silver certified applicator in the state and 1 of only three in New England. Kurt, Rick, anyone from SPFA? I respectfully ask you to chime in and explain to us here, the value we will get for our dollar by participating in your program. Again, please understand, I am not knocking your efforts. I just want to be able to afford to support them. How does the general population here on the message board feel about this? Respectfully
Circle-D Posted: May 26, 2013 10:26 PM	Apparently, everyone must be ok with it. My mistake.
Dan Beecher Posted: May 28, 2013 11:28 AM	I've been mulling over your question for a week now, trying to think of the way we need to address this as an industry. I have never in my 20 years in this business been asked for any certifications from a contractor or homeowner. Almost every bid project out there calls for a minumum number of years of proficiency in the field, but not once have been asked to prove it. With all the new foamers jumping in the market out there, I think the first responsibility needs to be with the foam mechanic. Unfortunately with the work ethic of this country now that doesn't always happen. The next line has to be the distributors that are setting up these guys and selling foam to every Joe Schmo with a checkbook without checking them out. My partner and I have both been foaming for 20+ years now. I'm not going to pay a bunch of money to take a bunch of classes and a whole bunch of tests to see if I qualify as an apprentice. I learned this business from a great boss and mentor. I am glad that there is more competition out there, that means foam is gaining more market share. But I see all these new guys coming in, not even knowing the building codes, spray application do's and dont's, or how to troubleshoot. I don't think voluntary certifications are going to help much, make someone a bunch of money though (ex. ABAA). I think if I was new to this business today, I would welcome all the help and knowledge I could get. Mistakes in this business can and usually do cost thousands of dollars, unfortunately most of these guys aren't told that. For us "old timers", I still think classes are a good thing, codes and issues arise every day it seems like, maybe if I want the cert just let me take the master foam mechanic test. Don't know if this helps answer the question, just my view.
mason Posted: Jun 06, 2013 10:40 AM	The SPFA certification program was developed as a reponse to EPA and OSHA's specific focus on the SPF industry particularly the residential industry. To paraphrase them; "If the industry does not provide certification to their applicators, we will and you probably won't like it as much." The suppliers are really behind this program much more so than the old accreditation program. Some are requiring at least the assistant level certification by a specific date. The program consists of exams for both the assistant and installer with an exam and field exam for the master installer. I was part of the committee that designed the exam preparatory curriculum. It is very similar to the old SPFA accreditation courses but the exams are given by certified exam providers and the instructors of the courses are not involved in the exams. I am certified to give the field exams and can also give the exam preparatory courses. I cannot give a field exam to anyone who has taken a course from me in the last 2 years. I would recommend taking at least the assistant and the installer exams. Skip since you have already taken the SPFA accreditation courses, I would just get copies of the course manuals from SPFA ($50 each) and then take the exams from someone near you who is certified, For example George Spanos has a certified exam provider in his organization. The information in the manuals is very good and up to date. I endorse the program and expect it to around a long time.
mark moyer Posted: Jun 14, 2013 02:47 AM	be all that you can be... certify,,, seperate yourself from the hillbilly down the road....and be able to show what this seperation is... soon they will ask for it in residential,,already are in some commercial..one or the other.. if you notice this is an "industry" supported and developed program...hopefully,,down the road..they will require this certification to have access to their products..this would be huge to protecting our livelyhood...no longer will they sell to any hillbilly with a rig bought off ebay or craigslist from some other failed hillbilly,,a failed system from a failed failure,,doomed for failure again at the industry's expense (read your and my expense fellow hillbillys)...anyone reading all the odor posts and crap install posts again?? anyone else getting the calls about "should this look like this?" support the SPFA,,,pay your dues,,,it is all you have,,, if we dont look out after ourselves,,big brother will look out after us,,this i promise,,,wingtips,,lots of em tappin and lookin for a place to legislate,,, certify,,,the process it complete,,the algorythem is easy to follow,,,the costs modest.. dude
polyol Posted: Jul 13, 2017 07:02 PM	Just a money grab by the SPFA, all it is doing is making spray foam more expensive and lining their pockets.
polyol Posted: Jul 13, 2017 07:05 PM	There are those in the "industry" that do not support the SPFA in any way.

Author

Comments

Circle-D

Posted: May 12, 2013 09:08 PM

SPFA Certification

What is everyones take on the PCP program the SPFA has introduced?
I am all for proper application of our product but feel this is an extremley expensive way to get it. All you 30+ year veterans have to drop back and start as assistants, then go to installers, then to master installers all the while paying threw the nose.
If your a member it ONLY costs you $250 to registar, $200 for EACH test and then ONLY $950 for the field exam.That comes out to $1800 to get to the master installer level and then another $175 for the annual renewal.
If your not a member this rises to $2600 and $225 annual renewal.
Seems I read somewhere in the SPFA vision statement about making this "affordable among our intended constituency." Seems like there is a contridiction of terms here??
As I stated, I'm all for doing it right and making sure we have qualified applicators. I think the best way to get voluntary compliance with the program is to make it "affordable among our intended constituency."
If your an assitant, take the test and move on to the next level. If your already a veteran, take the master installer test and pay the fee, pass or fail. You shouldn't be required to start at the bottom to support a fundraiser. I realize it took a lot of money to get this project off the ground and it needs to pay for itself. If more people take the one or two tests they need instead of only a few taking all of them the revenue will follow.
So folks, as foamdude would say "this is to provoke dialog" Am I looking at this from the wrong angle? I would like to support the program but don't really have the $2600 to dump. I have only been in the business for 6 years and still consider myself a newbie but don't really think I need to go all the way back to first grade either.
I have NEVER been asked about certification or qualifactions by any of my customers....EVER. So why spend the dough. I spray the Bayer foam and have been certified to the Silver level by them. They tell me I am the only Silver certified applicator in the state and 1 of only three in New England.
Kurt, Rick, anyone from SPFA? I respectfully ask you to chime in and explain to us here, the value we will get for our dollar by participating in your program. Again, please understand, I am not knocking your efforts. I just want to be able to afford to support them.
How does the general population here on the message board feel about this? Respectfully

Circle-D

Posted: May 26, 2013 10:26 PM

Apparently, everyone must be ok with it. My mistake.

Dan Beecher

Posted: May 28, 2013 11:28 AM

I've been mulling over your question for a week now, trying to think of the way we need to address this as an industry.
I have never in my 20 years in this business been asked for any certifications from a contractor or homeowner. Almost every bid project out there calls for a minumum number of years of proficiency in the field, but not once have been asked to prove it. With all the new foamers jumping in the market out there, I think the first responsibility needs to be with the foam mechanic. Unfortunately with the work ethic of this country now that doesn't always happen. The next line has to be the distributors that are setting up these guys and selling foam to every Joe Schmo with a checkbook without checking them out.
My partner and I have both been foaming for 20+ years now. I'm not going to pay a bunch of money to take a bunch of classes and a whole bunch of tests to see if I qualify as an apprentice. I learned this business from a great boss and mentor.
I am glad that there is more competition out there, that means foam is gaining more market share. But I see all these new guys coming in, not even knowing the building codes, spray application do's and dont's, or how to troubleshoot.
I don't think voluntary certifications are going to help much, make someone a bunch of money though (ex. ABAA).
I think if I was new to this business today, I would welcome all the help and knowledge I could get. Mistakes in this business can and usually do cost thousands of dollars, unfortunately most of these guys aren't told that.
For us "old timers", I still think classes are a good thing, codes and issues arise every day it seems like, maybe if I want the cert just let me take the master foam mechanic test.
Don't know if this helps answer the question, just my view.

mason

Posted: Jun 06, 2013 10:40 AM

The SPFA certification program was developed as a reponse to EPA and OSHA's specific focus on the SPF industry particularly the residential industry. To paraphrase them; "If the industry does not provide certification to their applicators, we will and you probably won't like it as much."

The suppliers are really behind this program much more so than the old accreditation program. Some are requiring at least the assistant level certification by a specific date.

The program consists of exams for both the assistant and installer with an exam and field exam for the master installer. I was part of the committee that designed the exam preparatory curriculum. It is very similar to the old SPFA accreditation courses but the exams are given by certified exam providers and the instructors of the courses are not involved in the exams.

I am certified to give the field exams and can also give the exam preparatory courses. I cannot give a field exam to anyone who has taken a course from me in the last 2 years.

I would recommend taking at least the assistant and the installer exams.

Skip since you have already taken the SPFA accreditation courses, I would just get copies of the course manuals from SPFA ($50 each) and then take the exams from someone near you who is certified, For example George Spanos has a certified exam provider in his organization.

The information in the manuals is very good and up to date. I endorse the program and expect it to around a long time.

mark moyer

Posted: Jun 14, 2013 02:47 AM

be all that you can be...
certify,,,
seperate yourself from the hillbilly down the road....and be able to show what this seperation is...
soon they will ask for it in residential,,already are in some commercial..one or the other..

if you notice this is an "industry" supported and developed program...hopefully,,down the road..they will require this certification to have access to their products..this would be huge to protecting our livelyhood...no longer will they sell to any hillbilly with a rig bought off ebay or craigslist from some other failed hillbilly,,a failed system from a failed failure,,doomed for failure again at the industry's expense (read your and my expense fellow hillbillys)...anyone reading all the odor posts and crap install posts again?? anyone else getting the calls about "should this look like this?"

support the SPFA,,,pay your dues,,,it is all you have,,,
if we dont look out after ourselves,,big brother will look out after us,,this i promise,,,wingtips,,lots of em tappin and lookin for a place to legislate,,,

certify,,,the process it complete,,the algorythem is easy to follow,,,the costs modest..

dude

polyol

Posted: Jul 13, 2017 07:02 PM

Just a money grab by the SPFA, all it is doing is making spray foam more expensive and lining their pockets.

polyol

Posted: Jul 13, 2017 07:05 PM

There are those in the "industry" that do not support the SPFA in any way.

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